Monday, February 09, 2009

NYCC AIM Roundtable

Being as how I had to skip NYCC largely due to a domestic emergency (more on that when I get the pictures uploaded), I decided to hold a bit of a roundtable discussion of the news coming out from the convention amongst some online friends to see what they were thinking.

So...what is the biggest announcement from the convention as far as you're concerned?

[18:38] Steve: i'd have to say the restructuring of the Ultimate line.
[18:38] James: biggest announcement for me? hrm... yeah
[18:38] James: the Ultimate Relaunch
[18:39] Greg (Anderson, of & The Minds of Greg): Me personally didn't care much for announcements going on. Was more excited hearing about the new stuff coming from Radical Comics
[18:39] Schwapp!!!: what in particular about that relaunch makes it so high on your list, Mud & Steve?
[18:39] Schwapp!!!: Any particular project that Radical caught your eye with, Greg?
[18:39] Steve: Ultimate Spider-man is constantly in the top 25 sellers as far as i know. it seemed odd to relaunch a bestselling book
[18:39] Aaron: I'd say, for me, the Batman news. But there wasn't that much that seemed like big news to me.
[18:39] James: ultimate spider-man was the comic that brought me back to comics after the late 90s drove me away (in particular astonishing x-men v2 issue 2 was the end for me)
[18:40] Steve: though i'm happy as long as i get more Millar on Ultimates/Ultimate Avengers (with Pacheco, yay!)
[18:40] James: so now.. the book that brought me back... even with it coming back.. it feels like leaving school.. like when you graduate junior high, becaue yknow your friends are still gonna be with you in high school
[18:40] James: but it will still be different
[18:41] Steve: U. Spidey brought you back to comics?
[18:41] James: yup
[18:41] Steve: that's cool.
[18:41] James: ultimate spider-man 13 to be exact
[18:41] Aaron: brb -- bladder about go nuclear
[18:41] Schwapp!!!: Aaron, what is a particular Batman nugget that caught your attention?
[18:41] Greg: Well, theres FVZA and Rider of a Storm by David Hine, Hotwire by Steve Pugh, their upcoming Aladdin book, Steve Niles' City of Dust, new Hercules, Rick Remender's The Last Days of American Crime, Cholly and Flytrap
[18:42] Steve: i've heard similar stories before. Ultimate Spider-man is one of those books that converts people.
[18:42] Greg: seems Radical Comics are literally gonna be knocking stuff out of the park
[18:42] Greg: great writers and just superb art
[18:42] Schwapp!!!: Ultimate Spider-Man grabbed me at the time, too...not sure it brought me back, but it kept me in the shop.
[18:42] Greg: heck, Hotwire by Steve Pugh was so much darn fun, 30 something pages for only 3 dollars?
[18:42] Steve: Hine is at Radical now? i may have to check that out..
[18:44] Aaron: I found it interesting that they are trying all these diff. books.
[18:44] Aaron: I'm not sure how it's going to work, but they're definitely giving it a shot, to run off the RIP and movie momentum.

What are the top three projects you're looking forward to that were showcased at NYCC?

[18:43] Greg: Damn... hmm
[18:43] Steve: i tend to ignore press releases for companies i'm unfamilar with. perhaps i should pay better attention...
[18:43] James: hrm.. gimmie a sec on this one
[18:44] James: Okay The Marvels Project by Brubaker and Epting
[18:44] Greg: Well, FVZA by Hine, Image United by the original Image dudes, Aladdin: Legacy of the Lost from Radicals
[18:44] James: thats prolly my number one right now
[18:45] Aaron: The Spider-Woman motion comics thing has the POTENTIAL to be huge, like we talked about. But it could also flop like a used tampon.
[18:45] Schwapp!!!: ...
[18:45] Steve: Hickman on F4 with Eaglesham, Millar and Pacheco on Ultimate Comics Avengers, and Morrison doing new Seaguy
[18:45] Schwapp!!!: You have a way with words.
[18:45] Aaron: Why thank you!
[18:46] Steve: What excellent manners you have, Aaron!
[18:47] Aaron: Oh!
[18:48] Aaron: DC FINALLY coming out with something significant on Free Comic Book Day: Blackest Night #0
[18:48] Steve: whoa...blackest night zero?
[18:49] Steve: color me intrigued.
[18:51] James: The Bronx Kill is another book that I'm looking forward to btw
[18:51] James: Peter Milligan and James Romberger

Any strong feelings on iTunes getting the Spider-Woman motion comic 2 weeks before the comic shops get the traditional comic?
Do you see the potential for spoilers as a huge drawback?
Or not worth being concerned about?

[18:46] Greg: Heh, that's what they're doing?
[18:46] Greg: Hmm, undecided
[18:46] Aaron: I don't have strong feelings, no. And I understand why they're doing it that way.
[18:47] Greg: As long as it gets new people to check out some books.
[18:48] Steve: i'm okay with iTunes getting the comic 2 weeks early
[18:48] Steve: though i won't be reading/watching the book anyways.
[18:48] Greg: I'm one to avoid spoilers like the plague if it's a book I'm reading
[18:48] Steve: SUCK ON THAT, BENDIS! ;)
[18:48] Aaron: Hux, it might be more trouble for the people running the boards than for anyone. :)

Would your opinions about the move be different if it were a more high profile property?

[18:49] Greg: I actually never get the mentality of people wanting to be spoiled when it comes to a book they enjoy
[18:49] Aaron: Hmm.
[18:49] Aaron: I would just have to be more careful to avoid stuff, I guess.
[18:49] Aaron: But I AM looking forward to Spider-Woman. So I hope I'm not spoiled on it.
[18:50] Steve: i might respond with unbridled fanboy rage and write a hate-filled post on a message board if it was a higher profile book
[18:50] Steve: but that's about it.
[18:51] James: spoilers do not bother me...
[18:51] James: i mean i sometimes actively seek them out, if i dont then what happens happens
[18:51] Steve: certain spoilers bother me. like the big reveal of a mystery character, unexpected deaths
[18:52] James: my only concerns for this iTunes model - is exclusivity and format
[18:52] James: exclusivity wise i dont want to see a digital version of diamond here
[18:52] Aaron: Good point.
[18:52] James: and format... i have concerns about how much of a COMIC will be kept.. i watched a very interesting digital comic today
[18:53] James:
[18:53] Greg: I really hope comics dont go full on digital.
[18:53] James: that I think would be much better than a step between animation and still life
[18:53] Greg: I know TokyoPop is going to start releasing some of their stuff digitally and I absolutely hate that idea
[18:54] James: I would have those concerns regardless of whether or not it was Amazing Spider-Man 600 or if it was Vigilante #8

Do we think that this move with Spider-Woman is a sign of comics moving closer to regular digital delivery?

[18:56] James: i think its too early to say, but i think it - along with things from tokyopop (like Greg hinted at) is a push towards taking it seriously
[18:56] James: the watchmen motion comics seem like pure novelty let me cash in on this movie
[18:56] Aaron: Well, it's an experiment. Like in that digital comic James linked to.
[18:56] Steve: i do think that is where everyone seems to feel comics should go, but i'll always prefer reading an actual book in my hand with paper.
[18:57] James: and if you look at the digital comic world - i mean torrents and hubs teeming with such a large percentage of the entire comic industry - its a market that is there
[18:57] James: it does fascinate by the way that right now marvel and DC have people finding, scanning and cleaning up digital files for them for free of ultra obscure material digitally
[18:57] Steve: i thought the same about the Watchmen motion comic, James.

Thinking of the Watchmen motion comic, how do you feel about the likelihood of voice overs accompanying motion comics? Is this an added value or a drawback?

[18:58] James: definite drawback
[18:58] James: with a cartoon or a movie having the character have a specific voice is one thing
[18:58] Greg: Wow. Hearing this stuff is news to me.
[18:59] James: but doing it to a comic - it starts getting, in my mind, a conflict of styles
[18:59] James: and i also thing it further fills in that bastardized animation/comic middle ground
[18:59] Aaron: Also, that completely alters the way you interact with the comic.
[18:59] Aaron: IMO
[18:59] James: no, you are right
[18:59] James: now its MORE PASSIVE
[19:00] James: and who the hell is gonna deliver grant morrison written dialogue? :-D
[19:00] Aaron: HAHA!
[19:00] Greg: The thought of not going out to buy comics from a shop, not having it in your hand and having to read on computer screen just irks me
[19:00] Greg: People are getting damn lazy
[19:00] Aaron: Yeah, where's the motion comic complete with voiceover and sound effects of FC? :)
[19:01] Steve: Who's going to deliver Grant Morrison dialogue? The answer is Matt Fraction.
[19:01] Steve: or Gerard Way.
[19:01] Steve: Both are mini-Morrisons.
[19:01] James: no no.. i mean the actors Steve
[19:01] Aaron: Shit there's a 2-page spread in Alias with Luke and Jessica with 51 text balloons.
[19:02] Steve: oh...i should probably go back and read all of the stuff before i comment on things after i've been afk :P
[19:02] James: hehe :-D
[19:02] James: Aaron - must of them are "the hell?" it be like a remix album
[19:02] James: "the hell?" "the hell?" "the hell"?
[19:02] Aaron: LOL

Who in the group has read comic books in CBR or CBZ formats, downloaded via torrent?
Is the difference in experience worth the cost benefit you'd likely get if they were offered legally?

[19:02] James: ill say i have
[19:02] Aaron: I have once. And it was a pain in the ass.
[19:03] Steve: I used to before i officially started buying comics.
[19:03] Steve: Now the only comics I will read digitally are Miracleman and Flex Mentallo, and I plan on buying those if they're ever reprinted.
[19:03] James: most things I DL are out of print older stuff and/or books that i have purchased and do not have access to at that time..
[19:04] James: for instance, when i was up in dallas for 4 months, towards the end i was jonesin

Is the difference in experience worth the cost benefit you'd likely get if they were offered legally?
Obviously, you're not paying for the current CBR/CBZ offerings. If offered from publishers, they'd certainly cost less than the physical product. Would the $ saved compensate for the difference in the experience (electronic vs. in your hands on the toilet)? ;)

[19:04] Aaron: Hux, I seriously doubt it.
[19:04] Greg: I can totally understand people torrenting titles that are long out of print like Miracleman and Bishop: Last X-Man, or Milligan's Enigma. I mean, where else are you going to get them?
[19:05] Greg: Heck, I'm still wondering each passing day when Marvel will finally release Priest's full Black Panther run.
[19:05] Steve: the difference would be worth it
[19:05] Steve: Paper books ALWAYS >>>>>>> digital
[19:05] Greg: And dammit! I wish I thought of that to ask Joe Q that at the con
[19:06] James: so for me, as long as i can still buy a trade of certain material eventually, i would switch like that ::snaps fingers::
[19:07] Steve: I will always prefer the physical product. Even if it costs more.
[19:07] James: if i had legit low cost CBR/CBZ files for issues, but could get trades? done!
[19:07] Aaron: I'd hang onto the paper as long as possible.
[19:07] James: can i add one thing to this whole digital comic thing, Khux?
[19:07] Greg: I do like, though, when certain sites let you read an issue for free as a way to test out the book
[19:07] Schwapp!!!: you all can feel free to add whatever you want to the discussion, so go ahead, James
[19:08] James: i wont name names or places, but i can say without a doubt that some of the most excited, passionate, well-tempered friends ive ever encountered have been in hubs
[19:08] Greg: Like Image Comics. On their site they have a lot of the first issues of their books up and you can just read them and see what's your type of book before jumping in.
[19:08] James: i have seen discussion in there that blows away anything on message boards - especially in terms of respect for each other
[19:08] James: if you could keep THAT aspect with the digital comics, i would be even more happy
[19:08] Schwapp!!!: By hubs, we're talking about torrent sites? or usenet?
[19:09] James: dc++ hubs
[19:09] James: direct connect servers
[19:09] Schwapp!!!: ah, OK

If the companies started to offer more of their comics digitally, would their availability to you earlier in digital format than in physical format influence you to adopt digital sooner?

[19:11] Greg: I don't want to accept digital reading.
[19:11] Greg: As I stated before, maybe an issue to preview a whole series
[19:11] James: for me? not so much :-D
[19:11] Aaron: Take for instance these Batman books coming out ...
[19:12] Greg: but I can't get myself excited at all for that
[19:12] Greg: Actually
[19:12] James: im like the anti-Greg here :-D.. or Greg of earth 2
[19:12] Greg: I'm looking at it wrong
[19:12] Greg: I'm looking at it as digital replacing the solid product entirely
[19:12] Aaron: If they were $0.99 each on iTunes, I would consider getting some of them that I wouldn't buy for $2.50 at my LCS. But it wouldn't be a complete shift.
[19:12] Greg: if they can do both solid paper and digital, by all means
[19:13] Greg: but if digital is to replace the solid product, I'm against it.
[19:13] Aaron: But I'd still buy Blackest Night in actual paper form.
[19:13] Aaron: I'm with Greg.
[19:13] Schwapp!!!: but you still wouldn't personally be in the market for the digital, Greg?
[19:13] Greg: Me? No.
[19:13] Aaron: I'd just have to wait until the trades, honestly.
[19:14] Steve: The availability would of digital comics would not affect me.
[19:14] Steve: I'd also wait for the trades, like Aaron.
[19:14] James: ill say one thing - digital pull lists like podcast subscribing would at least mean you never miss an issue :)

If the publishers offered a model where you purchased trades in advance but received digital delivery of the chapters while waiting for physical delivery of the trade, would that interest you?

[19:14] James: Khux i would sign up for that right now
[19:15] Aaron: Yeah, I could see that.
[19:15] Aaron: I usually buy stuff I already know I'm getting anyways.
[19:15] Greg: Man, watch comic readers really get fat due to them not taking the steps to go to a comic shop to buy the actual books. Everything now is ordering online.
[19:15] Aaron: And that way, I wouldn't have to worry about being spoiled.
[19:15] Aaron: Heh
[19:15] Greg: I'm one to prefer going out and tracking down my stuff.
[19:16] Steve: I'd be okay if I received the digital comics in addition to the paper books.
[19:16] Aaron: If I get the collected edition in the end, I'm ok with it.
[19:16] Schwapp!!!: So, Greg, you'd miss the thrill of the hunt?
[19:16] Greg: Hell to the yeah
[19:16] Aaron: Of course ... that would make dropping a book problematic. :)
[19:16] Steve: I'm with Greg 100% on this one.
[19:16] James: dude there is going out and tracking things, and then getting fucked over because your comic shop forgot to pull something for you and know its sold out diamond - as my previous shop did MULTIPLE times
[19:16] Greg: Only time I ever ordered a comic was Elephantmen and that was because the site was giving about a 40 or 60% discount
[19:17] Steve: The thrill of the hunt through shop after shop and longbox after longbox is part of the draw of collecting comics.
[19:17] Greg: The thing is, when my LCS don't have my books, I got elsewhere to where they do have it.
[19:18] James: and that can be occasionally fun to track down the holy grails.. i did that with certain back issues (first beta ray bill)... but no other industry is okay with bad service sparking an adventure
[19:18] James: if the adventure is personal, it is of course different

With the TPB/digital idea discussed above, would you expect to pay less than full price for the TPB, regular price or have to be additional for the added value of digital delivery?

[19:17] James: between a dollar less to a dollar more
[19:17] Aaron: I'd still expect to pay less.
[19:17] Steve: Well personally I'm not big on the digital thing, so I'd only get it if there was no extra charge beyond the regular trade price.
[19:18] Aaron: Wait. No, that's not true. I'd be willing to pay list.
[19:18] Aaron: Because it's still (usually) cheaper than buying the floppies.

Unless anyone has some thoughts they want to add, I think this is pretty good for the first experiment

[19:19] Aaron: Glad to help. :)
[19:20] Greg: heh, was kool
[19:20] James: all i will add is that if they move forward digitally they need to remember that the content will become more and more important
[19:20] James: i could download a million comics any time i want, and yet i still dont read spider-man :)
[19:20] Aaron: HA!
[19:21] Steve: I'd just like to say hi to all of the ladies out there, and that despite what the doctor says, the rash is NOT contagious.

What are your thoughts?


  1. My thoughts are, Damn, I wanted to be in on this!

    Also, I hope digital comics aren't the future. Nothing replaces the book in your hand,

    And also: Steve, that rash IS contagious. you SOB!


  2. Wow this collection of personalities together on the net and Chris Hansen didn't show up??? Whutsupwitdat????

  3. I have very little interest in this Ultimate line relaunch mainly due to them allowing Jeph Loeb to run wild and screw everything up. The names of the books 'Ultimate Comics...' is simply terrible.

    Ultimate Spider-Man does not need to be relaunched, Bendis came across as really wishy-washy in his interview on Newsarama about it too. It's hard to know what Mark Millar will turn up these days. They say the problem was that the timelines all got out of sync yet they give the flagship book (Ultimate Comics Avengers) to Millar, who has a history of delays and Carlos Pacheco, who is said to be fairly slow. Plus they are giving Loeb his own team-up book to play around with.

    The Ultimate Universe was good for a while, but I reckon this relaunch will not reaches those dizzy heights.

  4. Chat transcripts. COMPELLING

  5. Leading a discussion via an online chat mines less compelling opinion than a few guys sitting around a microphone talking about comics?

    You work with what you have access to.

  6. Well, yeah, a lot less compelling. What are the qualifications of the guys you have discussing the news? How does it rate anymore than discussing comics with, well, ANYONE? Plus, you guys are not entertaining at all, if there was some wit involved it might make it worthwhile.

  7. Well, Anonymous (if that is your real name), entertainment and wit are all in the eye of the beholder. But you're asking for qualifications?



    The only qualifications many podcasters and bloggers have are the very podcasts and blogs they are currently working on. That and their passion for the topic they're discussing.

    In this case, the point was to just get the reaction of a few fans/followers of comic books to the news coming out of the convention. Whether they had a pedigree or not wasn't relevant.

    You didn't find the blog entry funny or entertaining. That's your right and your opinion is duly noted. But you should really stop trying to act like you're making a statement of fact.

  8. I farted and poop came out!

    Aha-ha-ha! ZOINKS!


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